Rock 103: Alrighty. Welcome to uh - I say welcome to Memphis, although I think there probably are some people who wouldn't extend a welcome. I'll try to be generous about it.
Rollins: That's unfortunate.
Rock 103: Yeah. Well, we extend you that welcome--thank you for being here.
Rollins: Alright.
Rock 103: Uh - Henry is doing the show at the uh - New Daisy, on Wednesday--tomorrow night. I guess it starts about 8:00, and is one of several shows that he's doing as a benefit for the West Memphis 3. And let me make a - I don't know if you got my last response to - when we were exchanging emails, to the um -
Rollins: Yes, I did.
Rock 103: Yeah. You know, as I said to you in my last email - you know, I certainly don't object to the uh - DNA evidence being tested. In fact, I welcome it. I think that maybe it would put this thing to rest, or I hope that it would.
Rollins: Yeah.
Rock 103: But my objection to what - to what the West Memphis 3 uh - movement uh - has done is that my experience with them, having been quoted on one of the bulletin boards and then recieving alot of hateful email, is that your followers out there seem to think that these people are absolutely innocent and ought to be freed and they don't want to hear any discussion about it.
Rollins: Yeah. I'm not part of any movement, nor is the - are the people I work with part of any movement. I mean, I know the people at the West Memphis 3 support group.
Rock 103: Right.
Rollins: But we work quite independantly of them, and I am not looking for a get out of jail free card for the three young men incarcerated. I'd like to just see some of this evidence - like you say, uh - compelling evidence brought to - you know, the judges and the lawyers, so it can be done in the proper way. Uh - so this thing can be put to rest one way or the other. Uh - and that's what we're in pursuit of and we have none of that zealot thing, we're just going for the cold and sober facts and uh - we're helping to finance the processing of the DNA evidence and um - it's quite an exorbitant sum and the state -
Rock 103: (talking over) How much is - I mean, when you talk exorbitant sum, how much are we talking about?
Rollins: Well, they're saying uh - that it's a hundred thousand plus dollars.
Rock 103: (whistles) Wow.
Rollins: And I don't know what is done, I'm not a lab technician.
Rock 103: Right.
Rollins: I'm quite a by-stander, but um - so, we are doing about 41 shows in 11 countries and all the profits from the t-shirts and ticket sales are going to these lab technicians who do their DNA testing thing.
Rock 103: Right.
Rollins: And that's uh - that's the full reason why we are touring. We hold no - I mean, I don't know - I don't know who did this. Those three young people in prison right now found guilty by uh - you know, a jury of their peers. I - I know alot of people don't see any real compelling evidence to put them in there. I don't see any real compelling evidence linking anyone to this thing so far. So, hopefully with the DNA evidence, there is the "smoking gun" and alot of people will stop uh - you know, posting things on email websites and what have you. And this, as you well know, this evidence could come back inconclusive. It could also come back uh - implicating the three guys in prison, everyone will just say "see we told ya". Uh - just if it implicates someone else, it still doesn't mean the three guys in jail weren't there.
Rock 103: Right. Are you familiar with how um - how preserved the evidence would be and uh - would the -
Rollins: (talking over) No, I am not. And I'm not um - I'm not aware of uh - how contaminated a sample can be before it becomes valid. I'm not a lab technician.
Rock 103: Right. Because I listened to Barry Scheck in the OJ Simpson trial and was just thinking, he wore out Dennis Fong so bad with the evidence that was fairly fresh in the OJ Simpson case and uh - for him to argue on the other side that - that it wouldn't be contaminated or it would be fresh, would be taking both sides of an issue and making it - and turning it into the situation to fit your situation.
Rollins: Well, yeah but also they find DNA uh - relevant DNA samples on - on things that have been in the ground for quite awhile.
Rock 103: Right. But Barry said - but my point was, Barry is - he argued vehemently that the OJ Simpson stuff was - was mishandled and it - you know, this was contaminated and not able to use, and in this case if Barry takes it he would argue just the opposite and it would be interesting to see how he argues it and what position he takes.
Rollins: Yeah, but I think arguing to or for anything is one thing, evidence that gets processed by some impartial lab technician and comes back one way or the other - you can't really spin or argue away 2 and 2 is 4.
Rock 103: Um hmm.
Rollins: You know what I mean. So if they get what they consider compelling and conclusive evidence -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right.
Rollins: I don't think you can argue against it or for it. It is - it's like saying you put a rock on the table and say "well the rock isn't there", well it is and we can all see it. So we're looking, you know, hoping to see that this evidence comes back where everyone on both sides of opinion can go 'oh, ok' and that's what I'm looking for personally. I want something where noone can mess with it. Where we all go out of there - some people happy, some people sad, some people mad, but all of us going 'ok, now we all know'. That way there would be no more arguement.
Rock 103: You have commented in your May letter on your website that this may not make any difference anyway, because it was a botched case from the beginning - in your words - and so the evidence may not be testible.
Rollins: Yeah. I don't uh - from what I've read and the people I've talked to, the crimescene was not very well maintained. There's a lot of people walking around through it and um - this makes it difficult for detectives to do their work. I mean, I know a crimescene's the utter pristine state of a crime and can tell you many things you need to know, so - from what detectives have told me. And that you've got to leave it alone and let the pros go in there, well I think alot of people were walking around in there so um - that was the - that was not ready.
Rock 103: One of the things - and maybe this is beside the point but nonetheless, one of the things that pisses people off in this part of the country is the implication on your site, and then on the wm3.org sites, that this was southern justice, it was a bunch of backwoods rednecks, they didn't know what they were doing.
Rollins: Well sir, I'm not here to insult anyone. Uh - I'm really going - only going after the evidence. I do think that in a case where you have three dead 8 year old boys or girls - 3 dead children -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right.
Rollins: That really throws alot of people into a hyper state of upset. I mean, 3 dead gansters somewhere, ok well that's the game they're playing -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right.
Rollins: Three young children don't deserve to die under any circumstances, anywhere, anytime. And so when you have that going on, the level of anger and rage and you know, the parents of these children - I don't know how they get through the day.
Rock 103: I understand.
Rollins: Uh - and so, someone's got to be caught for this. The detectives, the local police, the local jurisdictions are all thrown into this, you know, angry people demanding that someone is found guilty.
Rock 103: Right.
Rollins: I think this situation throws any citizenship, any good people into a real state of upset. So I think that the town of West Memphis, Arkansas was thrown a real hard patch of road when these three young men were killed. Uh - and so I don't expect anyone to act - at times, act totally rational or anything, so I'm not thinking all that backwoods thing. I just feel for - mainly, I feel for the parents and the relatives of these kids and their upsets.
Rock 103: (talking over) Well, you know you -
Rollins: (talking over) And in court, you know, when you have a judge who doesn't know the term forensic odontology, maybe he should have requested some help and some advice.
Rock 103: Yeah.
Rollins: Maybe he's not all that schooled on handling triple homicides. Uh - and maybe that's just a testiment to how good the town is - they don't have such horror. You do this - you perpetrate an act like this in, you know, New York or Detroit and people are more ready for it just because that stuff unfortunately happens -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right, common place.
Rollins: Not often, but more often enough to where they're like 'oh, here we go' -
Rock 103: (talking over) Well, you know, we were actually talking earlier (laughs) - it would have been entertaining to see them try to explain DNA to the jury -
Rock 103 (female): Um hmm.
Rock 103: You went 'right - the double helix and the chromosomes and that' -
Rock 103 (female): Um hmm.
Rock 103: It would have probably gone - 'cause it went over the OJ Simpson jury's head at one point.
Rollins: Yeah well, it's tough stuff. It goes over my head. I mean, and you know, I took - you know - 2 or 3 years of biology, which doesn't make me in any way an expert but I know what deoxyribonuclease acid is.
Rock 103: Right. Isn't that LSD?
(laughter)
Rollins: I had to read the damn book on Roston and Crick(?) and their discovery on it, but what I do know is that uh - when they get conclusive results back, it is indisputable. And much of this case was uh - kind of circumstantial. I saw him, he said, she said - which is uh - that's just uh - to me - in the court of law, public opinion - he said, she said is big stuff. In a court of law, hard evidence - in my opinion, really works and the pursuit of that um - for the benefit of anyone incarcerated, um - guilty or innocent, I think is valid and I don't see us as doing a bad thing. That we upset or offend any of the parents or relatives of the deceased is much to our regret, absolutely -
Rock 103: (talking over) Have you spoken -
Rollins: (talking over) - We're not trying to at all.
Rock 103: Um hmm. Have you spoken to Damien or any of the other two?
Rollins: Yeah, I speak to Damien's wife and I speak to uh - the uh - the girlfriend of Jason -
Rock 103: (talking over) Baldwin, yeah.
Rollins: I have no real contact with Jessie Misskelley. Um - but I keep in touch with Damien via letters and his wife, and I write Jason fairly often.
Rock 103: How did you uh - become involved, was it the uh - Sinofsky's HBO special that got you into this?
Rollins: I saw those and it made me interested, but that's - as we both know, anything like this hits the tip of some iceberg and it's only one opinion and you've got to check it out, but it did make me quite interested and so I -
Rock 103: (talking over) Was one of the reasons you became interested is because of their uh - their musical taste, they happen to like your music?
Rollins: Absolutely not. Uh - I get asked that alot. Like, do you think it could have been you in a different city - well, no. I was born and raised in Washington, DC, I'm well educated, and I moved to Los Angeles to play music - I don't think that's going to happen to me in either city.
Rock 103: Um hmm.
Rollins: What - what - you know, the way this whole thing went down, nor am I into the occult or the devil or evil. I don't even smoke or drink or do any drugs, so I don't really find that - any similarities with - you know, any - you know, also I'm 42, my mopey teenage years are well -
Rock 103: (laughter)
Rollins: Um - but what was really interesting to me was the lack of due process that the three boys incarcerated uh - did not enjoy and the lack of miranda rights read to Jessie Misskelley and I went 'wow, that's not the way Americans should be treated - good or bad, innocent or guilty' and then when I found out that there was retracted testimony where people said "Well, I really didn't see anyone do anything, I was in jail on a drug charge and the cops told me to sing or I'd go to jail" -
Rock 103: Um hmm.
Rollins: "But I said what I said and I'm sorry I said it, because it is in fact not true." Well, I read a few of those. When I found out there's DNA evidence that the defense had no budget to test, then I became real interested. I went 'oh, well there's more going on here and there's a chance at seeing real indisputable truth' - you know, in the form of DNA testing - as far as I'm lead to believe.
Rock 103: Right, I gotcha. Ok.
Rollins: So that made me interested and the people I work with - band and management, I went to them and said "Well, why don't we do something to raise some funds and raise some awareness about this", so other - especially young people can - you know, look at what goes on in our country and have an opinion and look around and see that - you know, things shouldn't - to me, this is very patriotic. Like, we should be looking our for each other, looking around and being aware of things. And this was a good opportunity for young people uh - to - or anybody really, to look at the way court systems in this country work 'cause um -
Rock 103: (talking over) How did the wm3.org uh - start? I noticed - I mean, you said that you're a separate entity from wm3.org and -
Rollins: (talking over) Oh yeah, I'm a citizen - yeah.
Rock 103: But - but - your website is framed by the wm3.org site.
Rollins: Well no, we have a link to their site and I often say "If you wanna know more about this case, go to wm3.org". And they have alot of - you know, they have addresses you can write the Governor of Arkansas -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right.
Rollins: - And ask him a question. They have addresses of the three boys, and they tell you what's going on with the case as where they stand, and the website is maintained, uh - you know, fairly often and I think it's maintained very well. And I have referenced people to that because I think the website has more information than I could ever give them and it's better for them to do it on their own time rather than have me lather up and so -
Rock 103: (talking over) Mind if we take a couple of calls?
Rollins: You do what you'd like, it's your show.
Rock 103: Ok, cool. Hang on a second. Let's see, line 1 - Rock 103, good morning.
Caller 1: Yeah, good morning crew.
Rock 103: Morning.
Caller 1: Um - I live in that area, uh - in fact, those three boys lived one road over out my back yard.
Rock 103: Um hmm
Caller 1: Uh - use to see 'em playing in the neighborhood all the time. With all these what if's and maybe's bouncing around, I've got a what if and a maybe for ya. What if these three boys are actually guilty and maybe they are properly convicted and they've - you know, that's the end of it. And that's the end of it, when will that happen?
Rollins: Whenever they get valid DNA evidence in, then we'll all know for sure.
Caller 1: Oh no, well then there'll be some other - you know, some other kind of evidence that'll have to be needed and you know, some more money that will have to be raised and something else will have to be done.
Rollins: Well, (talking over) (can't understand beginning of sentence) money and the boys will be incarcerated the entire time so everything is going your way.
Caller 1: Well.
Rollins: You're winning, so.
Caller 1: Oh, I'm still winning? Nobody won in this case, nobody won a damn thing.
Rollins: They're in jail, this is not costing you a penny and uh - that's it.
Caller 1: Oh, it's not? Each prisoner costs $36,000 a year to maintain.
(pause)
Caller 1: Hello?
Rollins: Yeah.
Rock 103: What his point is that they're not getting out of jail, they're gonna be incarcerated while all this is taking place, and I'm -
Caller 1: (talking over) The - the - (sighs)
Rock 103: They're not getting out of jail.
Rock 103: Let me -
Caller 1: (talking over) These boys they did kill - what about them?
Rock 103: Well.
Caller 1: Well, you know - where are they now?
Rock 103: Well, let me ask Henry - uh Henry, if the DNA evidence uh - comes back uh - not in their favor, uh - are you willing to drop this?
Rollins: Absolutely. Ofcourse. No, I only go where the evidence goes.
Rock 103: Because I think I know what uh - John here is saying is that - and I must admit that you've disarmed me, you sound like a pretty well spoken guy and you know, so I'm cool with that, but the - I'm still pissed off at some of the members of the followers of wm3.org and my experience with them is it doesn't matter what the DNA evidence comes back, they're still going to be fighting this battle no matter what.
Rollins: Well, that's for you and them to discourse on whenever you get to.
Rock 103: Right.
Rollins: For myself and the people I work with, we're going with that which is indisputable that a judge and a jury can look at and go 'oh, ok' and so far there's really been no smoking gun. There's been alot of uh - circumstantial evidence and um - and so I think some people should be open minded enough to see that they might not have been given all the information the first time around.
Rock 103: Ok. Line 2, Rock 103....Line 2, ya there?
Caller 2: Yes, I am. Uh - I am a very open minded person.
Rock 103: Um hmm.
Caller 2: And I agree if they are innocent - you know, if there's more evidence. But I have a problem with celebrities and such jumping on a bandwagon and doing concerts and saying that the profits will be given to the cause, exactly what are you going to be paid during this concert of 41 cities where people who don't even know what's going on, who didn't live in this area during that time? That's the problem with celebrities -
Rock 103: (talking over) Did you understand what she's saying, Henry?
Rollins: Well, it's kind of hard to hear. Uh - I think I'm being asked what am I being paid for all this, am I a celebrity jumping on a bandwagon - this is the second year - the second summer actually, I've been working - I've worked with this - our seond year I've been working on their behalf and um - all the profits going from the record we made last year are going to - you know, their lawyers and the DNA people, as well as every single penny of profit from these 41 shows. So there's nothing financially in it for me.
Rock 103: Is Barry - who - you said "their lawyers", is Scheck - my interest is in Barry Scheck because I'm familiar with him and he did indicate an interest in this case - is he on -
Rollins: (talking over) Yeah, he and his Innocence Project are quite interested in the case and they are working with the DNA uh - evidence process on this. Uh - his - the full scope of his involvement, I do not know. Uh - I don't - I really do not, um -
Rock 103: (talking over) I talked to Gary Gitchell -
Rollins: (talking over) So the bottom line is, there's no - there's no profit in this for me, nor am I looking to be famous off some case. I don't need any of that. I'm interested in it - I don't need money that comes in this form. I would be - I think it would be abhorrent to make a profit for me on something like this. I couldn't live with that.
Rock 103: Ok. Well, I did - I spoke to Gary Gitchell and invited him to come on with us to uh - yesterday, and he declined but he did mention that he believes that Barry Scheck is still involved -
Rollins: (talking over) Yeah.
Rock 103: - and atleast looking at the case and that he was in town, in fact, last week.
Rollins: Ok.
Rock 103: Uh - line 3, Rock 103....Line 3?
Caller 3: Hello.
Rock 103: Yes. Hello, go ahead.
Caller 3: How y'all doin'?
Rock 103: Good sir.
Caller 3: Hello. I enjoy uh - the monologue that Mr. Rollins does as well. Uh - I also have to take uh - offense to saying the due process didn't happen. It happened in a court of law and every opportunity was given to defend themselves and throwing words like that into confused young people is an impressionable lie because it absolutely did happen. We were here in Memphis, we experienced, seen it on the news, and then knowing people over there in West Memphis that were present during the real story. We have to be careful in taking a HBO special and trying to uh - trying to make logical opinions from that. The birdman of Alcatraz, as we all know, they made a great movie about that, but the man was a child molester, stabbed a guard with a shank, then had several letters written in that was some type of outcry for his release until they actually found out the real story behind that. And the other thing in talking about how we may not be capable of finding issues, you remember on the Andy Griffith episode, uh - it was Andy Griffith that solved 'who stole the cows' when the guy was putting shoes on the cows, and the state police couldn't do it - so always remember that.
(laughter)
Rock 103: Alright Henry, you've been given a great analogy there from the Andy Griffith Show.
(laughter)
Rollins: Ok. I agree with the guy. I'm not familiar with the Andy Griffith reference, but um - yes, he said that we shouldn't be throwing out words like due process or something to confuse people, in fact, he is wrong about that as far as the uh - due process thing, not every single thing was extended to these boys in that uh - when you apprehend someone, you read them their Miranda Rights and they're formally arrested. Also, young men - anybody is allowed to have legal counsel present when they're being interrogated by detectives and you're suppose to have that made known to you. Jessie Misskelley - this was never made known to him, he did not even know what a lawyer was. And so when you're being questioned for 14 hours, uh - you're suppose to have an attorney present and he did not, nor did he know that that was an option to him. This is a breakdown in what's called due process. This did happen. So not everything was extended to these guys, so your caller is in fact wrong. And uh - to make some kind of Mayberry RFD reference, to me uh - is basically saying that you don't really care about the deaths of the three 8 year old boys.
Rock 103: That's not necessarily true, Henry. He just made an analogy.
Rollins: I, in fact, do and there's really nothing funny or to make light - I take all of this very seriously. So, I just want you all to understand that it's, for me, not all about three kids in jail or something I saw on HBO, it is about three dead people - you know, three boys who didn't deserve this. And um - the lack of due process, I think you'll find there were quite a few instancies of this, that the people responsible for this will probably admit to that.
Rock 103: (talking over) Ok. And um -
Rollins: Is what happens when heads get hot in a situat - like I said before, in a situation like this, I think people are going to be acting uh - it's hard to go - act to protocal when you have three - corpses of three 8 year old boys in your city morgue. I -
Rock 103: (talking over) Well, you know, you're right and it's partially because of - and obviously because it all happened here in our backyard that we're a little more sensitive to it and because we watched it on the evening news and uh - you know -
Rollins: (talking over) Absolutely.
Rock 103: In some case - I mean, you know - when they would look at the camera - they're sitting in the courtroom and they would look at the camera and stick out their tongues or they would make faces at the parents of the dead boys in the courtroom, it tended to sort of shade people's opinions of them.
Rollins: Yeah, I wonder how those shots themselves were shaded. Also, the West Memphis Commercial Appeal in Arkansas, uh - with blazing headlines like 'Human heads found underneath the bed of Damien Echols' uh - 'flesh still intact', in fact, no heads were found ofcourse and uh - the paper steadfastly refused to resign these allegations and this is the local newspaper. This is - talk about shading, uh - a citizenship's opinion. This isn't cool. Uh - I mean, I don't understand why a newspaper that's suppose to be impartial and fair would do such a thing. I mean, the National Enquirer gets away with it but everyone knows the actual -
Rock 103: (talking over) I understand what you're saying. It's sort of - it's difficult to shade a video - I mean, I watched it on the news and there was Damien sticking his tongue out and making faces at one of the parents of these dead boys. It pissed me off. It certainly - and I'm sure it shaded my opinion of him and these three, and I'm sure alot of other people in this area.
Rollins: Yeah - yeah. I mean, I would like to see that footage myself. Uh - yeah, that would offend me, too. You know, I would probably wanna leap out of my seat.
Rock 103: Yeah - yeah, you're right.
Rollins: Absolutely.
Rock 103: Um - ok, we've got Pam Hobbs, one of the boys' mom -
Rollins: (talking over) Yeah, yeah I know who she is.
Rock 103: Pam, you there?
(Caller 4)Hobbs: Yes, I'm here.
Rock 103: Ok Pam, what's up?
Hobbs: Uh - well, not a whole lot of much of nothing, just the same ol' same ol' with this case. Uh - I would like to ask, uh - this happened 10 years ago - if it was a copycat killer or somebody just passing through, how come something like this has not happened? And I pray that it never happens again. Damien Echols spoke with his own words, on the stand, how he felt a killer would feel. If you weren't guilty of something, wouldn't you say "I don't know how somebody felt as far as murdering someone" instead of going into details about it. And I was uh - the one that Damien licked his lips at and things, and uh - luckily God was with me and I didn't blow his brains out.
Rock 103: Well, I'm glad you didn't do that, Pam. Pam, how are you doing these days? We haven't spoken to ya in awhile.
Hobbs: Uh - well, I'm - I'm doing pretty good.
Rock 103: Ok.
Hobbs: Started a non profit organization for myself, also in memory of the three - M.O.M.M.Y. - Mothers Of Murdered and Missing Youngsters. And I would ask Henry Rollins, instead of trying to uh - get somebody out of prison that's already been convicted, what about all our hungry children in the world? That's a more worthy cause, I would think.
Rock 103: Ok. Uh - Pam, thanks for calling, we appreciate it.
Hobbs: Uh huh.
Rock 103: Well, let's see - do we have 1 more? Do 1 more...Line 1, good morning - Rock 103.
Caller 5: Ok.
Rock 103: Yeah, go ahead.
Caller 5: Ok - ok. Um. Yeah, I'm a teacher over at University of Memphis in southwest and I started using these videos at - for my argument class and um - about 2 years ago and my first question that I asked the students before I even let them see it or talk about it was 'do you think these guys are guilty' and about 3/4 of the class said "Yeah, yeah, yeah, they're devil worshippers and everything" and I said "Well, how do you know this" - "Well, because we saw it on the news" and I keep hearing people calling in and saying - you know, people are jumping on the bandwagon after watching these videos, and the celebrities are jumping on the bandwagon and it's the same thing that happened on the other side - you know, when this stuff came out and the way that reporters reported things, it was so jaded and it was so closed minded. And it was completely one sided. Because we all wanted to find someone guilty. And I remember when it came out and I thought 'oh, I can not believe these people and these horrible things' and for years and years, thought that they were guilty as well. But the evidence doesn't point to them and the only thing that they have clearly is the confession of Jessie Misskelley. And I pray for Pam Hobbs all the time because I think about these kids and the aweful things that she went through and I hope that the people in Memphis will realize that this evidence that we can get will either find them guilty or not guilty -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right, good point.
Caller 5: And we can close it and all be safe with it. Now this thing about not happening again (sighs)
Rock 103: Well, you know, I don't see a need to go there - so -
Caller 5: (talking over) I don't either.
Rock 103: That's sort of beside the point.
Caller 5: Yeah.
Rock 103: I don't want to stray too far from where we are. Well, Henry makes a good point, what he said earlier was, nobody's asking these kids to be let out of jail while this investigation is going on. They're still incarcerated, and the investigation continues, and when they bring back the evidence and it's put on the table, then there could be closure for this once and for all.
Rollins: Yeah. Also understand that uh - for someone in prison to pursue their freedom - you know, by uh - evidence and stuff, it is their rights. Nothing illegal -
Rock 103: (talking over) No, you're right - right.
Rollins: (talking over) - that is being attempted here.
Rock 103: They have appeal process and they also - you know, that's exactly right. Ok.
Rollins: Yeah. It's, uh - it's their duty, you know - and the innocent and the guilty both do it. The one thing that stands out to me is, if you're on death row, the only thing separating you from a date with lethal injection or however they execute you in their state, is your appeal process. And if compelling DNA evidence is brought forward and you're guilty, I don't think you're jumping up and down with joy. I think you're like 'well, if compelling DNA evidence is brought against me, I think my appeals kinda fall a little flat. -
Rock 103: (talking over) Um hmm. It's true.
Rollins: - and they give me a track suit and they run me at my execution.' Damien Echols on the other hand, is very excited about the prospect about going to court with valid DNA evidence. He wants to go to court. And so now we get on purely speculative terms, but if I were guilty - if it were me, I wouldn't be happy about DNA evidence that could -
Rock 103: (talking over) Right.
Rollins: (talking over) - really nail me to it. So -
Rock 103: (talking over) Now what's the time frame here?
Rollins: (talking over) - I wonder why if Damien would be guilty, why he would be so happy and why Jason Baldwin also is estatic about this.
Rock 103: (talking over) What's the time frame -
Rollins: (talking over) He related this to me.
Rock 103: (talking over) What's the time frame for the - you know, you giving the money and them starting the investigation and the DNA testing?
Rollins: Ok. The DNA evidence testing is going on, it has been going on and apparently, uh - there will be results this year.
Rock 103: Ok.
Rollins: So, um - there is - you know, there is something to be known before Christmas time or - you know, before putting on our New Year's party hats, so um - maybe we'll have this discussion on a different plane at some other point. But it's not like some fine day this stuff is going to be tested, apparently it's on and it's been on for quite some time.
Rock 103: And you're funding the researchers and the lab techs and all the people that are doing that right now, through what you're doing?
Rollins: Yeah, what we're contributing money to, we're not the only people and um - and through the idea of the celebrity and bandwagon thing - I've been doing shows for - you know, all over the world for 23 years. I've never had a gold record or platinum record, I don't enjoy much air play or MPD attention, so I've never really considered myself a celebrity like some movie star who does something for like 5 minutes and then fritz off somewhere else. I've worked hard all my life, so I really don't - caught in that flakey celebrity thing. I've met a few of them and they're not my kind of people. So, um - I consider myself and the people I work with on this, we are concerned citizens, we are fellow Americans. You have to remember where you live, you live in America, we are allowed to descend, we are allowed to disagree -
Rock 103: (talking over) That's right.
Rollins: - and my opinion is what we're doing - we're completely above board on the level and if I saw anything slight of hand or underhanded about what we're doing, I would cease that activity. I'm not down with that which is illegal, that which is evil, that which is wrong - I'm not with it, I'm not into it, I don't want to be part of anything like that.
Rock 103: Right. Well Henry, the show is gonna be Wednesday at - I'm thinking, 8 or 9 o'clock - I'm not sure, at the -
Rollins: (talking over) It doesn't matter, it doesn't seem to be anyone much interested, so 8-9 - show up and be one of the 30 or 40 people.
(laughter)
Rock 103: Now Henry, stop that. Well, it's going to be at the New Daisy on Wednesday. One of 10 or 12 dates that Henry Rollins is doing to raise money for the testing -
Rollins: (talking over) Actually 41 in 11 countries -
Rock 103: (talking over) Ahh, right.
Rollins: (talking over) - this thing ends in Tokyo, Japan in late July. And uh - we've been playing well - the show, it's not like it's a bad evening out - you know, some people might not be enthusiastic about why we're doing the shows, but the music is in fact good and we're playing well and uh - we're quite happy to go out there and hit it.
Rock 103: And you're doing alot of the old Black Flag stuff, right?
Rollins: Yeah, we're only doing that.
Rock 103: Alright.
Rollins: Yeah, this is a one time, one time only thing.
Rock 103: Gotcha.
Rollins: The only way I could justify doing this music would be in that it's a benefit thing and I'm not making any money.
Rock 103: Now Henry, when you're in the orient and you're playing while wearing a hospital mask - that could be interesting. Now be careful over there.
Rollins: Yeah, I was just in Thialand recently and uh - to walk through the airport and see pretty much everyone masked except for me, except when their cell phones would go off, they pull the mask down.
(laughter)
Rock 103: Yeah - ok.
Rollins: Kinda defeats the purpose.
Rock 103: I hear ya.
Rollins: But yeah, it could be a little dicey over there, so we'll have to look for our travel advisories for guidance.
Rock 103: Well, be careful.
Rollins: Thank you.
Rock 103: Well Henry, thanks very much and as I said, you uh - I must admit that you've uh - you've disarmed me a bit since my initial email to you when I called you a son of a bitch -
Rollins: (talking over) I understand and I just want you to know that we're not trying - we're not tough guys and we're not trying - you know, to be anything. We're just concerned, we're looking for some real black and white facts here and that's all we're after and we're using a little rock n' roll to access it.
Rock 103: Well, if you ever have a chance to just let the people at wm3.org to be a little less zealous, uh - it might help the cause.
Rollins: You'll probably find there's alot of student aged people there who would rather be passionate rather than couchant and - you know, really looking at it.
